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  1. #11

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Hmmm see I think I would prefer to have an obvious lesion which represents an acute injury rather than a non-existent specific "strain" which equates more to RSI than a one-off trauma

    It sounds like you need a bit more info from your vet to be able to make judgements re treatment options and prognosis. It sounds like your horse has PSD from the surgical options offered? Some horses do come back to a decent workload but others don't really improve :/

    I don't think putting heartbars on is going to have a dramatic effect either way if that's the diagnosis, good shoeing with appropriate length would be the important detail imo, doesn't sound like wedges have been suggested.

    With most soft tissue injuries time is the main factor in recovery, time and careful controlled exercise.

    I'd have a chat with whoever the lameness specialist is at your practice and try to get it straight in your head with the expert on hand.

  2. #12

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Thanks for reply, and sanity check.

    So... 2nd shock wave yesterday. The vet (the one I've always had, who even did the vetting) performed the shock wave said he didn't want to comment on treatment as was under another vet at the same practice.

    Spoke to vet at the same practice. I asked for clarity what the treatment plan now was as horse is becoming a little bit of a handful. So, horse will have a further 4 shock waves and also laser treatment. Then will medicate the hocks, and in the mean time, if I cant handle walking him in hand, I can under saddle for 30 , 40 mins. So I assume this means I can hack in walk?

    The thing is, originally I was told, 6 - 12 months off work, shock wave... then operate, 3 weeks box rest and then re hab back to work.. and now, because I told my vet practice I had spoken to another practice on how they would treat this, as I felt I didn't want the horse operated on due to my own lack of knowledge what was involved, my practice said we can go down this route. Same route but has again changed, as no PRP mentioned now, which makes sense due to the previous comment in this thread - I get that... but... now I'm questioning how bad is this 'proximal suspensory'... because at the initial diagnosis, the way I was told, the horse had no chance basically would be PTS.

    So - exercise under saddle safest option:I will get back on this weekend, and ride down the road , round and back. My only concern is, in my head the horse is broken ? is it? or do I need to just get on with it .
    Last edited by jumping.jack_flash; 15-06-17 at 08:09 AM.

  3. #13
    Old nag Auslander's Avatar
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    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Quote Originally Posted by jumping.jack_flash View Post
    My only concern is, in my head the horse is broken ? is it? or do I need to just get on with it .
    I've got a horse with PSD, and while he's vastly improved after lots of treatment/rest/rehab, I look upon him as fragile, and take great care with how I work him. Deep surfaces are out, and I rarely ride him in the school, although he's at a point now where he can cope with a bit of a play in there. I do hours and hours of walking on the road, as it's a stable surface, and only trot/canter when the ground is firm, but with a bit of give in it.
    I look on it as similar to a person who has gone over badly on their ankle. It will get better, given time, but there will always be a higher risk of reinjury, so although horse has a relatively normal workload (bearing in mind his age/other issues), I take great care not to risk his legs by working him on dodgy ground.
    Mine is getting on a bit, and his PSD was pretty severe, so I take each day that he is sound enough to ride as a blessing, and never expect anything from him
    Vets with Horsepower: Trans-European 'Play It Again, Sam' Tour 2012
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  4. #14
    Old nag
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    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    my horse had prp in 2015 for a hole in his hind nearside suspensory ligament they scanned both legs and the other one was fine, he had 5 months box rest then re scanned and it had healed and he looked sound, so we started walking under saddle and over about 4 months gradually got back to full work.

    similar to auslander I am very careful with whatever he does I don't school to much no galloping no jumping and he has been fine his 13 now, they did offer me the De nerving if the prp didn't work but I would not have gone ahead it just doesn't sit right with me, I too take every day I have him to ride as being very lucky and never take him granted we are now hoping to do a few ridden shows this year.

  5. #15

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Quote Originally Posted by jumping.jack_flash View Post

    So - exercise under saddle safest option:I will get back on this weekend, and ride down the road , round and back. My only concern is, in my head the horse is broken ? is it? or do I need to just get on with it .
    as with Aus, the ones I've known have been, essentially, rather fragile horses. If you want to keep them in work then caution is the best approach, but if you've been told to exercise him then quietly clip clopping round the road is the best option.

    My oldie hasn't had PSD but she has had 2 ligament injuries and one tendon injury-all done in the field She is in full work and competing again but I am extremely careful with her, because even though hers were acute injuries, the risk of reinjury is still there her regime is pretty similar to Aus's horse with loads of road hacking and I rarely find off-road ground that I'm happy with to take her for a canter. She does 2 days a week in the school now and is fully sound, but these days we have left are precious and I know there will come a time when she can't do it any longer.

    Vets can't really give you a definite prognosis with this kind of condition because it depends on so many factors, and luck is one of them. But don't be afraid to quiz them on the treatment options, you're paying for it so you should be clear on what you're choosing.

  6. #16

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Thank you all... never thought I would be writing on the H&H with an issue... these forum's are very helpful and informative. and really pleased to hear that people are back out competing ! gives me that much needed boost of hope!.

  7. #17

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Just been chasing up Vets - re treatment plan. This week Tuesday and Thursday - Laser Therapy / Next Week Wednesday 3rd Shock Wave / Following Monday and Thursday Laser Therapy / and then the following Wednesday 4th Shock Wave.

    So, yes I have been googling again, and reading over the H&H threads, and MP your point of RSI to me makes total sense, as when looking at the scans there are no black holes, or black gaps indicating 'lesions'. And where I work there are medics - who also have confirmed that there does not seem to be anything wrong... so the scans do look a little fuzzy in places.. no defined white lines.. but is this the scan or is the strain?

    I would of liked to upload on here, but it has personal details of the horse and Vet practice, so best not to upload.

    I have not ridden the horse since Friday 26th May - so it will be 4 weeks off work by the 23rd June = [

    Anyone had laser therapy?

    I guess my 5K insurance for this NEW Claim will be used up soon, as I googled how much just the shock wave treatment was and it over 209 pounds per session and that without the vets call out, and sedation. Lets hope the horse comes sound.

  8. #18
    Schoolmaster
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    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    My horse was recently diagnosed with PSD in one hind leg. The vet was very thorough scanning both hinds, and the way I understood his explanation was that if the ligament is healthy, you should be able to see lines along the ligament. If all you see is grey dots all over ("disordered fibre pattern") it's a hint that there is some degeneration, likely something along the lines of an RSI or chronic injury, rather than something acute. He was also looking for a gap/black area between ligament and cannon bone. If that is gone or ill-defined, it can be a sign of thickening/swelling of the ligament. My gelding had a disordered fibre pattern and less well-defined space to the bone on the injured side.
    However, he also has back issues and it's well possible the leg is actually secondary to the back problem. It's an ongoing story.

    On the shoeing front: there seem to be two completely opposite approaches: My vet recommended shoes with a wide-web toe and narrow branches, and working on soft surfaces so that the heels sink in more. Apparently, this puts more load on the flexor tendon, but less on the suspensory ligament. Others seem to recommend the exact opposite - support the heel (with e.g. egg bar shoes) and avoid soft surfaces. My vet's explanation makes sense to me - there is a trade-off between the ligament and the tendon. You cannot unload/reduce the strain on the leg as a whole, unless the horse isn't using it. See here, for example:
    http://brandonequine.com/publication...ent-injury.pdf

    The vet was quite clear that the special shoes were not likely to have any particular effect (different from normal shoes) unless I worked in my horse on a school surface. On firmer ground, the narrower branches obviously don't sink in, and the shoe acts just like a normal shoe. I figured I didn't have much to lose on that front, other than an extra 10 to the farrier to make the shoes.

  9. #19

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Quote Originally Posted by jumping.jack_flash View Post
    Just been chasing up Vets - re treatment plan. This week Tuesday and Thursday - Laser Therapy / Next Week Wednesday 3rd Shock Wave / Following Monday and Thursday Laser Therapy / and then the following Wednesday 4th Shock Wave.

    So, yes I have been googling again, and reading over the H&H threads, and MP your point of RSI to me makes total sense, as when looking at the scans there are no black holes, or black gaps indicating 'lesions'. And where I work there are medics - who also have confirmed that there does not seem to be anything wrong... so the scans do look a little fuzzy in places.. no defined white lines.. but is this the scan or is the strain?

    I would of liked to upload on here, but it has personal details of the horse and Vet practice, so best not to upload.

    I have not ridden the horse since Friday 26th May - so it will be 4 weeks off work by the 23rd June = [

    Anyone had laser therapy?

    I guess my 5K insurance for this NEW Claim will be used up soon, as I googled how much just the shock wave treatment was and it over 209 pounds per session and that without the vets call out, and sedation. Lets hope the horse comes sound.
    The damaged bit of ligament in high PSD is in an area where the ligament runs through a groove in the lower part of the hock. Although the damage to the ligament isn't huge, there isn't room for the ligament to swell and then heal, so it presses on the local nerves and just niggles away. That is very non technical but hope it helps.
    The fasciotomy procedure just gives the ligament a little more room and relieves some pressure. It is usually the next step after shockwave if you want to treat further (not everyone does). PSD can go hand in hand with other issues like sacro dysfunction or kissing spine.

  10. #20

    Default Re: Platelet Rich Plasma

    Hummm thanks SupSup/ Ihatework,I'm going to go back to the scans and look. I know I should stop reading up, as I'm not getting the answer I'm looking for, as no matter what Im doing, the horse still has an issue needing to be addressed. I just don't understand how this has happened. Just got home and first invoice is in . .i was right, nearly 1.5k gone already. I'm disheartened. This is so unfair, I wish I could just wave a wand and make everything right. ��
    Last edited by jumping.jack_flash; 19-06-17 at 05:24 PM.

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